Ignite Your Brand

There is a lot of designer ego though. Like, I have it. Heck yeah. Right? Like, I mean, we're perfectionists. It's a, it's a thing. It's a thing. I struggle with it. We're, we're design snobs. I mean, that's what makes us good designers. We're snobs. Thank you. You have to be.

Welcome to the marketing team of one podcast, where we have conversations about the issues one person marketing teams face when trying to meet their goals with limited time and budgets. Welcome to the marketing team of one podcast today. We're lucky enough to have a special guest with us. Leader extraordinaire, um, president CEO of yourbrandspark.

com. Calvina. Welcome. I am so happy to be here because it's you, Eric. I mean, like I like it's, you know, like you are a very, very important person in my life. So seriously. Okay. I, we're, I should be on the crying couch. I'm starting to well up. No, it's like I was, I'm so excited to be here. And as I was driving here, I was just thinking that like, I don't know if there's any other person who can probably bring.

Um, some of the conversations that I think I can talk about here, just because you know me from, we were, we were friends like from our twenties, you know, like, like really early on when we were just starting our families and when we started our careers together, literally within days of each other, you, you, Claimed I was in my 20s.

I that was awesome. That's the highlight of my day. Thank you very much for that I was well into my 30s, but oh that's different Well, you look like you're very relaxed. This is a very natural thing for you. Thank you for being here This is how I sit on a couch at home. So i'm thank you for letting me sit like this.

Absolutely. Yeah, we're just Chilling and chatting. We brought you on because for one, I know that you do a lot of really interesting work with a lot of small companies, organizations, your brand spark. So your history, let's talk a little bit about where you came from and what brought you to starting your company that you run now.

You know, it started with me working with it, with design agencies and, you know, as a designer and, you know, from a junior designer all the way up to working, you doing more managing. Like bigger projects and, you know, taking a bigger role in, um, in design. And then, um, when I started my family, I decided to, uh, to really take the time for my family and then, but then there was the entrepreneurial side of my brain that never stops turning and, you know, that kept going even as I, um, I let go of like my full time job as a designer in an agency.

And so that's when my, I started my photography business. So I've had my photography business for 15 years and photography was my first love and really stumbled upon that, like, um, just doing what I loved. And then so eventually, basically by the end of that career, I was doing brand photography. Um, I was traveling to, uh, I was doing projects in India, working with nonprofits and, um, small, like social enterprises over there who are working.

Um, and I did brand consulting, I did photography, basically helping some of these, these businesses to, Pull together a voice to give them a voice. And what they're doing is giving a voice to the communities that they're helping. So a lot of them are purpose driven types of businesses. And that's kind of where my heart is.

And so, so it's all about giving a voice. So I was really putting together all the design and the, you know, um, the art directing and also the photography in all of that. And so what I saw, um, in, during that period of time in working with small businesses and small brands, and they're all small because they are, uh, a lot of, these businesses are just, they have a heart and they have a, you know, they're like, I want to start this thing.

I want to do this thing, but they don't know where to start, where, how to do it. And, and, and then, and they're trying to really have a bigger voice in the marketplace. How small are we talking? One, two, 15, 30. It depends. Like some of these, well, the, the, the, the small, the social enterprises are, are large.

Well, they're, they're like, they're, they're man, like the. the forces are there, you know, basically training of artisans and these, these, um, you know, marginalized, you know, communities in another world basically. But this, the teams themselves might not be big. They're probably, you know, five to 10 if, if, if that, like many, much even smaller, but they take on a lot of different roles.

Their primary role is to care for the community and to connect the communities. But then there's also a. business aspect of what they do, which is they need to sell the goods to like, basically enable them to like care for that community. Right. And so, so I, you know, like that's where my heart is like, okay, there's so many businesses out there who are doing good, who really start wanting to like make a big difference in the world.

And there's so many, you know what I mean? Like, That's, those are the businesses that I really care about. And they're, they haven't, they have a hard time with their budgets. They have a hard time with, you know, resources. And so that's why I think I have a really big heart for small businesses with small teams that are stretched to the max.

But then, um, and then, so I'm no longer sitting in a place where I'm doing design for, you know, these big corporations that have the budget to have like, um, not only their own design team, but to be able to hire out a, you know, um, the, an entire design firm and a design agency to do the work and then like do all that stuff.

It's a very different kind of a place. Right. And so they, this company, these small companies will need to be able to figure out how to market themselves. They have to understand what they want to say, so they don't know that. They don't understand enough about their own voice. Um, they know why they got things started.

They know their purpose. They know their, like, their vision. But what they don't know enough about is, like, how do I get more visibility? Mm mm-Hmm, , how do I look more legit because they're like doing stuff on their own. They don't know. And, but they don't yet have the budget to really be able to, um, pull together or even hire an agency or so.

So let's talk, you talked a lot about brand specifically. Yeah. When you say that, what do you mean by brand? What, what, because everybody comes into this with. We're trying to help people understand what the word brand means. So this is how I like to, um, define brand. Um, you know, because, you know, because of my design background, I specialize in visual branding, right?

But there are so many different levels of the word brand. Um, ultimately, if you really like boil it down to its purest form. I think a brand is a relationship. It's a relationship between your audience and you, right? You as in the business. And, um, and then the, the audience being your, your ideal, who you're talking to and you need to know enough about them.

And so in like, what I see it as like this merging point in the middle and your brand is like, what happens in the middle? Right. So you have like, so it's basically your, your business. You have a story, you have a vision, you have a purpose, you have a certain aesthetic, you have a certain vibe, right? You're not going to appeal to every single person.

You only will appeal to your ideal audience and who you're specifically wanting to cater to. And so now that, Uh, you know, the, your ideal and had their story, they have their, their needs and their pains and all the things that they, they need their problems solved. They have their vibe and they have their story.

They have their, I said the story already, but they have a certain, um, sensibility about them. And then, so when you have and merge together and you develop a brand that fits both of you, that's how you're able to connect and attract and also like retain this relationship that is, um, It's about trust, really, right?

And then so, um, I think we're kind of in a, in a place in our, in the world and marketing where a relationship is everything. Trust is everything. So brand is all about that trust. And so, um, so there is, of course there is like, there are different aspects of your brand, right? Visual is only one aspect of it.

Uh, but there are so many different things. There is your, um, there is, even like your personality, you know, I think it's, you know, like showing up and just like being vulnerable and just talking into like, like a video and doing that. And it doesn't have to be, um, you know, processed or anything. That is a Brennan itself.

Right. Um, but what we specialize in, you know, like what I special, you and I like have our, Background, because our background is on InDesign, right? Mm-Hmm. , like, so the, the things that we are connecting is like the colors and the fonts and the logos and, you know, and then the layouts and the, you know, the, the, the big, like, you know, creating a campaign that can actually, you know, um, resonate and, and all of that stuff.

That's, I feel like is the visual side of things. And that's the stuff that I do, um, um, that I, I, I specialize and I, I, you know, um. It's what I do in my business, but beneath it all. However, I feel like there's so much more and I feel like, um, it's really the tip of the iceberg, right? It's the, the visual stuff is the tip of the iceberg is what people see.

But what I truly care about is the stuff beneath. And there's more of that than just the visuals. There is like, you know, So there's words with that. That's, I immediately think like, you know, marketing and messaging is around words and visuals and we're very visual people didn't, I didn't do great in English when I was in school, but that's another podcast.

But the words are so critical. Do you work with a copywriter? Do you have specialists? Do you have people that you pull from do you? It's so hard, you know, we talked about being genuine and I think that's where you know The rise of the robots takes away that genuine thing. So Those who are concerned about robots.

Yes. It's a fear. It's genuine. I get it But that's one of those opportunities where I don't think the robots can come in and provide that kind of genuine Storytelling as much as something that we could do connect to? Yeah, I think, well, for me, it depends on the project, right? So there are certainly projects that where I, you know, like, you know, when there is, if there is a lot of storytelling and a lot of copywriting that needs to happen, then I, you know, I would bring in, um, a copywriter partner who would work on a project together.

Um, but right now, um, like the part that I love, and it's not, and honestly, It's not what people are used to, and it's not out there, and I think this is the part that I care about the most is actually working, and I think this is why it puts me almost in the more of a, um, a place of a coach than in actually a place of a designer.

I'm a more of a, like a thought partner, a coach, um, with these small businesses. Then necessarily, even as a designer, I mean, I do the design for them, but then I think what they value the most is what I bring into like actually getting all of the things out of them, fleshing out. I was almost therapy, you know, like getting all their ideas so that I almost reflected back to them as if it's like a mirror and then say, they're like, Oh my God, like I didn't even realize that.

And then, so, um, so I do run a program. This is the thing that I'm probably. Most proud of. It's, um, it's a, it's a, it's a pro it's a course program called brand in a week. And what I do is like in a single week, um, it's group programs. So people will sit together and do it. And these people have no design backgrounds.

They're like not designers and they're not, um, they're just, there's, they're small businesses. They are like, some of them are coaches. Some of their product based businesses. Um, some of them are like, you know, like, I, you know, like, like a therapist who was like, uh, you know, say, you know, a service based business and then like educators and, um, consultants, you know, like all of these people who are their own small business in themselves, like a lot of them are, you know, one or two people.

You know, person businesses and, um, and they need to, they want to get their ideas like they visualize it, they can see it in their own heads, but they have never been able to really put it anything on paper that looks good to them. They might have hired a designer to, to do something, but it's still not who they are.

Because maybe during that process, they focus so much on the visual aspect of it rather than maybe what's in Like their vision and what's like the feelings and the stuff that's like beneath it all that um, they're like, Oh, you know, they're it's almost flipping things on their heads where it feels like, Oh, this is not anything that I have ever done before.

You know, like pushing, it's almost, it really is like a therapy session. And then, so when they come out of it, um, I'm like, I'm teaching them to kind of do some design themselves, right? Like, so I'm helping them to teaching them to mood board for themselves, taking their ideas. And then like in that process, like by the end of the week, they've got their, their, um, their, their logo sketched, um, They're, um, like not finalized, you know, like a lot of it is sketched.

And so, um, and I mean, some of them, they could, they move on. Like if some logos are good enough to go, but then a lot of time it's like, this is an idea. I definitely need some fine tuning. Like, and then I would tell them very honest, I'm like, that's not going to fly. Like a logo needs to, you need to have all of these different versions of a logo.

You're, this is way too busy. Or, you know, it's, it doesn't ex, it, it, you know, like for me, I'm like, it has to exist in a single color. If it doesn't, if it doesn't exist in a single color, if it's too complicated, we can't shrink it down to this big, or if you can't blow it up to this big, then it's not gonna fly.

So I'll give them like, I'm totally honest with that. And like, we go through and have them figure out like their, their fonts. And that's the thing is that like you can go have a designer go through all these things. What I found, because I've delivered enough, right? you know, the brand systems to people where, like, they love it in the moment, but when it comes back to them, and I'm like, why aren't you using it?

You know, like what's, what's happening. They're like, Oh, there's something that it's not resonating. I don't know why it's not resonating. And I can't like, you know, and then, so basically going through this program, they, they get to know a lot more about design in itself. Um, they don't have to be designer.

And I tell them that I'm like, you don't need to be designers, but you need to know enough to be able to know what to do with like, Any branding system that you get in the end, right? Like you need to know enough about, you need to know how to hire a photographer. You need to know what kinds of images that you need that, that will convey your, um, your brand.

Well, so you're building a toolkit then that you deliver to their internal marketing team of one person, whoever that was. And they build it themselves and they do everything themselves. They do it themselves. And then, so I guide them through that. And I, it's like, Intense, like one week bootcamp where I'm like, no, like this is not like, but the thing is like, I am, um, but I, I guide them through figuring out what they want first.

So I'm giving them basically a compass. So it's like, then this is the part that I think it's, it's, it's hard for some people because it's like, um, you know, it's not, it's, it's hard for, I guess. Um, I talked to a lot of designers are like, I don't understand. Like, how can you, like, But they're not designers.

This is going to be crappy. Right. Um, so for me, I'm like, my, my goal isn't necessary that they come out with the absolute perfect design. Um, it can be some of these, like some of the stuff I've seen is insane. Like some of the stuff people, they'll go through at the end. They're like, I cannot believe I made that.

Like it's, um, yeah, they're like, this is unbelievable. I didn't even know that. Like, they're like, I didn't use my favorite colors. I would have not used these colors, but these work better because I realize this will resonate better with my audience. So they're, they're equipped with now a story and a reasoning and a background that's like, Nope, this is why this, our brand can't do that.

Yeah. It's got to do this. Because of what you've discovered on, on they discovered. And then, so they'll say things like, um, my, my tagline has been wrong all this time, or like, um, my offerings, I need to now restructure my offerings entirely because there are things that I realized about myself that I didn't even real, you know, like through that process of really like defining all that stuff.

What kind of troubles do you run into? Can't, I can't imagine every one of them is like, this is easy. It's as I can do this. I mean, is there, Ones where at the end of the week, they're just like, I'm done. I can't, this is terrible. The, the hardest part is for them to realize that they can do it, right? And then so, um, and I think that's my biggest challenge in even marketing my own services.

Most people don't feel like they can, right? Like we're not, I'm not living in a world, right, where this is the norm. Right. You know, so from the designers that I talked to, you know, they're like, you're crazy. You know, like you are, you know, like, why are you training these non designers to do this design?

You're, you're, you're basically flooding the market with like really crappy designs. Hmm. Or, you know, I'm like talking to, you know, like, um, small businesses, like I don't have design training. Like I can't do this, but, um, I've done this enough with people. I've seen that. I'm like, it works. Like it, like I, the success rate that I have at the end of my program is, um, no, they may, like, they're not gonna, I'm not training designers here.

Right, right. So, um, of course I'm not you, you know, like I, they're not necessarily going to be creating like massive campaigns. They will probably still need my help, you know, or a designer's help to put together something. But in the end, what they can do is that they will know exactly how to communicate to a designer later.

Yeah. And then, or they will know how to like, make things their own. currently living in a place where like small businesses need to turn media on a fly. Like, like, so like, you know, back in the days when, you know, you, you, you change the date and the time to have an event and you have to spend a day sending it to designer and then they, they, they fix it and they spend like going back and forth that just doesn't fly.

Right. Like, so like, so how do you, um, like, how do you simplify a system so that you can market? Easier and better. And, um, and then like being able to, um, for the small businesses to feel empowered, but it's not just the empowering. I think it's the light bulbs and the like the light that go like that. I see in their eyes that they never thought about themselves.

You know, like the things that I hear from them was like, I feel so brave. Like you made me feel brave. You made me feel like I'm worthy to be out in the marketplace. Cause so many of these small businesses, they don't feel like they've ever felt legit. So when they have a final brand that feel really proud of they're like I can do this on my like I can actually do this Well, it speaks to them too I mean the ability of them to want to embrace the process and understand the power that brand can bring to their organization I think that that's once you make that realization It's then you're hungry for services, like what you're talking about, probably because it's that you need to build that underlying passion and understanding of how critical your brand is to the public.

Yeah, exactly. And I, my goal is to not necessarily replace this. Replace designers with this process. My goal is to bring more like joy and realization, how important branding is. Well, and ease the relationship with the outside so that you, when the designer comes to you and asks why, and you say, Because you've got, you're empowered to say, Hey, yeah, this is why.

Yeah. So yeah, like one of the businesses that I worked with, like she is like really grown now. And then, so now she has the budget to hire like custom illustrations. She wouldn't have been able to know how to articulate what kind of illustrations she has, but now she has this brand guide and the brand kit and this whole development, like this brand system that she just, she just sent it over to, to an illustrator, explained to everything.

And then she was like, she got exactly what she needed. Nice. A process like that is good because they know they're making the investment and doing the process. They're going to have strong understandings and passion behind their brand when they're finished. But it's only a week and then after that they can or you can help them get things out there.

Curious about words. I go, I know I keep going back to words, even though we're designers. Um, do you, is that part of the process too? Explain a little bit about them. Words are the main part of that. Like, and I realized, and so like, you know, I've, I've, done this brand in a week program for, you know, like quite a few times.

And the things that I'm like, I basically drool in is I'm helping people translate words into visuals, visual back into words. And then it's the cyclical thing. And the more you go back and forth with the words, the visuals, then the more like, and I'm constantly making them define their feelings and words because it's all about emotions, right?

Like the whole point of having visuals is that is the most powerful way for you to convert emotional, like make an emotional connection without You know, like without even having the time to read anything or even to hear anything, right? Like words, right? Like whether it's coming out of your mouth or reading things.

It's like, you know, you're seeing the colors, you're seeing the composition, you're seeing the vibe, and that's gonna immediately grab your attention and make you stick around to actually pay attention to the words now. Um, but these visuals don't come about by itself. It comes from the feelings, but you have to translate these feelings into words first and these words into visuals and then back into words and then back in the feelings.

And so like it's this constant thing that I'm throwing at people. I'm like, like, well, how do you feel looking at this? Like, what are you trying to do? Right. And then, so, so it's just this, um, yeah, so it's, it's, it's a. back and forth thing. And so that is the most important exercise. And so my students come out of this and they're like, Oh my God, like there's so many words that I haven't thought about, you know, that describe the feelings and that described the vision that described the story and then from these words and the go into the visuals and then also like, you know, on a technical level, all these things go into, The keywords, it goes into SEO, it goes into the kind of copy you write.

They all really work together. So you need to be able to understand. So that's where I'm like, grab, you know, helping them to figure out that vision and the story and the vibe and all of that stuff. They all are cohesive and it all starts with words. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. I, I, you know, as much as I try to avoid words in my life, it's just something that's going to have to, I guess I can't give up on it.

Huh? Yeah. And, um, and I, I think that's the, you know, and the words, if you think about it, it's It's a, it's a way of our expression, right? I mean, like, your crying couch is like, you know, it starts with, you know, being able to express your feelings and your frustrations and your vision and that passion and the purpose and the fire and when it comes to a small business, that's everything.

And that's why they're doing it. And that's why I care about the small businesses, um, way more than like the, the core, the, the ones that will have like already, um, you know, corporate, you know, all of that stuff, because there's a fire in a small businesses that are still alive and raw. And it's powerful.

And most of these small businesses, they're, you know, that vision comes from wanting to make certain change, you know, in the world, whether it's a, you know, it's a. gap that they see. It's a need that they see that it's a change, you know, something. And I always believe in these small changes can change the world.

So that's the thing is you can connect personally with small businesses and organizations with the people directly. That's what's so that's their killer app. Right. Is that you get this like, I know that person, she's great. You know, and you've got this other, Energy rolling around in your brain around who that person is.

That's just kind of locks it in even further. Do you ever experience where somebody comes in and there's, I just need to make more money. I just need more revenue. I just need this. And then how do you deal with somebody who may be, cause you speak to emotions and you talk to feelings. There are people out there who are not really connected or maybe even uncomfortable with those feelings.

I wonder how do you work with those kinds of personalities? Honestly, You can't come, you can't create any business with that, with just money in mind, right? Like, I don't think that like you could, I mean, even my business, like, even, even though I'm like all like about feelings and, and, you know, and purpose and all that stuff, like I can't make my business run without revenue.

So like, I don't think that like, like money and revenue, all that stuff is independent of vision. Right. So still like you can't just come into the world and say money, money, money. And like there's, so even within that money, there's a reason they've chosen this particular business in this particular format for a reason.

Right. So like I chose to make money because, um, you know, I'm good at design. or I chose to make money because I'm good at finances, whatever it is, there is something there. So there is something there. So like I'm good at finances or I really think that people need to know more about finances on this level.

Right. And so there's always a story there. There's you have to be able to make that connection no matter what. Right. And then so, um, and there is, there is a story. I think even if that person comes in and say, I want money, you know, like, well, what's your business about? they'll tell you. And then it's, it's about, um, technology, you know, and then so we'll tell me why you think this technology is the most important thing, you know, for your clients.

And so, well, this technology, so there's, there's always this heart, there's a purpose, you know, like, so I think, so now that the story then it's about the technology and how this technology is better than other technologies. And then why does now, why should this, your, their, their client, Care about that technology.

Now you're digging into now that the needs of that client and their story and why they would choose this one over any other right. And so now there's there you're now tying that in. So in that way, you're eventually always going to lead back to the revenue. And like, I think revenue is always a byproduct of like being able to communicate purpose.

Well, there you go. That's pretty good. I like the way you sum that up. Um, well, and I think, you know, it sounds like during this process, I mean, is a lot of it formalized, like fill out this questionnaire and then we'll talk about it. Is it like literally like therapy? There's a person on a couch and there's a, there's handkerchiefs and I, my mom, you know, didn't do this.

It's so interesting. Like I, um, so I have the program, which, so the, the, the program is, um, yeah, formulated, but you know, like, because I, I have pre recorded stuff, like me talking clearly. And it's just like, they, they listen and they, but it's very short. It's like, this is why you're doing this. Cause I don't like people.

I mean, I don't have time to listen. People talk all day long. It's like, get me to the work. Like, I think it's in doing people learn. So I'm like, I'm trying not to like. to have people listen to me talk, but of course they have to understand a little bit something, but most of it, it's me guiding them in the doing, the learning through the doing.

And so, um, so yeah, there's the pre recorded stuff and then they do it. And then so that brand in a week, that one week is when they show up and then I'm critiquing. Ah, okay. So that's what it is. So that's the most powerful is the powerful part is the personalized feedback. I actually So it's through the work that I see.

So, I mean, I am actually like, kind of, I'm a, you know, that teacher. And I was like, I'm not, you're not showing your work. I can't help you. Like, I'm, I'm like that because true. Like, if you don't show your work, if you just, you know, like I can, you know, I can tell when somebody has put effort into it and just like, everything, right?

Like you put effort into it, you get more in reward. And so you, you know, I'm able to work with those who, um, put more into it because I can see more. And, um, but then of course I have my, my, my private clients, right? And then so the private clients that I do more of the work and I still feel like that process is more removed for them.

Hmm. Interesting. It's all in my head. Yeah. I do it. I'll create like, you know, I'll create all of the mood boards and that direction and the visuals and I can describe it to them and like, I will have, you know, very typical, you know, um, like agency process where you do your presentation. I, I. Always feel like the gap is in between there.

And then so, so like, because of that, like, I feel like, um, you know, I want to, so the, my one on one work, I want to do more work with them where I guide them, it's more one on work than I, I want them to do the work in the brand in a week, because I'm like, I need to see your work. I need to get into your head.

So that's where it's almost like the D student walks into class and I'm like, ah, dog ate my homework. Yes. Because. And that's the, and then that this is the part I think is probably my, like be completely transparent is probably the part that makes my own marketing. Harder. Like there's not anybody doing what I'm doing.

It's not what people are used to. I'm kind of bridging the gap between what used to be, which is like, you know, I'll do all the work for you. And then you run with it. Most of the time, almost every time I deliver great. Designs, I deliver great photography, but it's really sucks when I, when I don't see them using the photography, even though in that moment they love it and I asked them why?

And they're like, well, I just don't really know how. I don't know how it fits. I don't, you know, I want to, but it just, or I see them using it wrong. And I'm like, Oh, it'd be so much better if you used it this way. So that means it's like that education process. I feel like it's crucial. And then so, um, yeah.

I mean, I think it's important for like marketing teams to be educated on this stuff. Like, do you know what I mean? Like, so I'm, I'm talking to a marketing team. I think these are important education things, you know, too. And it's just like, how do you use it? Like, what is the most effective theme thing? And so that's the problem.

This is why I see it in the scam. This is why I'm so passionate about it is that when people are hiring me to do photography, you know, um, it's in my head, it's my creative vision. You know, and then so when it gets back to them, it's like, they're not making the most use of everything. But if we, if I am able to like bring them alongside me and almost co create together, which also requires, which is very hard for designers, and it took some time for me, is I have to let go of my own ego.

I have to let go of my own ego. I have to realize things are not exactly going to be the way I want it to be. But if they have more ownership of this branding, then they will be able to make more effective use of it. So in a sense, you will hand over the reins of trust to those that you feel have done the work genuinely are passionate about their brand and their design and their messaging and what they're going for.

And you're just like, all right. And that's why I think in terms of messaging, especially depends on where is the stage on this brand development process. A lot of the messaging, um, is the, they realize a lot of things. Like I've, I've like, seriously, like through the, like say the brand in a week process, they've come up with new taglines.

They've come up with new things because you're like, Oh my gosh, that's, I was going the wrong direction all along. Or like, I realized there's a new name for myself. Like I've had people change the. business names and in the halfway through they're like, that's not actually what I was going because I realized that's not, I thought that's what I wanted, but I think that's not what really my audience needs.

And that's why people say it was like, I thought that my brand colors would be my favorite colors, but no, that's not like you had me looking into colors that completely I would never have chosen, but I think works better now. And then, so, um, so that's why I feel like branding is, um, you know, more. Design is just the tip of the iceberg.

You know, it is just what people see. There's so much more beneath it. It's like a soul to that organization. I mean, like really, truly, I'm like, I was, I'm writing like a blog post about this. It was like, you know, like the, you know, the, the big thing about like that, that literally the iceberg and, you know, beneath the surface, it's like all the stuff, it's all the things.

but then like the tip is what you see. Right. And then, so, so that's what visual branding is. And so, um, but then to get to that visual brand, of course you can create, I mean, like it's not hard to create pretty designs. I mean like, and that's why I'm like, you know, when you can, you, you know, we like, Templates are so readily available now, right?

Like, um, they were not available even Adobe back then, but now even Adobe, there's like templates upon templates. You can like access, you know, like, but it's not going to be effective in our marketing strategy if it's just pretty. You know, and then so it's got to be able to make a connection into a vision and people do, you know, so like, so that's why I think small business need to be able to know what their stories are so that they know how to, you know, eventually when, like my goal is that when they grow, when they're big, they know how to, now they know enough about their own brand and they'll be able to like give directions to, you know, um, the designers that they hire and that, you know, they, they, and they would be able to have better sense of these things.

And, and like, and because I'm a small business, I've been. Owning a small business for so long, whether it's running a small, like a photography, um, company to where I'm at now is that, um, as much as we want to outsource, you can't outsource effectively. If you don't know it yourself. Good. Yeah. Right. And then, so like, of course you can have someone else build out your systems or whatever it is for you, whether it's anything, is that like, you can hand that over, they can do it quicker, but then like you, there will at some point be this disconnect where it's like, what are you doing?

Like, why is it not working? It's because there's, there is some kind of disconnect. And so, um, so that's why I feel like this brand language, you know, um, It's so important. So speak to me. I'd love to hear some success stories. Some, some, you know, person came to me, uh, didn't have anything or one person in a truck and now they're around the world or something like that.

Give me an idea. Um, so, okay. Like I, you know, some of the earlier businesses that I worked with that, you know, a couple of actually product based businesses, um, you know, one, she is, uh, she is, you know, she started her business making lip balms. Right. And then so she, you know, and she realized just like, everyone loves my lip balms and then I'm giving them away.

And then like, eventually it's just like, so many people are asking, just like, I'm selling them. And she was like, really surprised by how much money she was making on selling these. And then she started just to turn into a business. She had no idea. She was like, I was literally scribbling, like just hand drawing these labels on there.

And then I had no brand and she didn't have a name. She was like, no, no, no. Call myself. And then, so, um, yeah, so she like went through like, you know, brand in a week. And then, so in the end, like I did help to finish her logo. Her final logo was done by me, but she created all of these things where I got everything out of her head and she developed all of these things.

Um, so the final branding system, I helped her to pick it together. So it's, I know it works. I know every single color will work together. We came up with. Eight colors. I always do that. I'm like, I'm like four. Yeah. Because I feel like, you know, um, it's different than what, you know, back in like, I know, like, you know, my, like my original days was like, you know, you have two or three colors.

I feel like, um, because they need to do so much, they're, they're, there needs to be like a supplementary, um, palette, like four colors that I feel like you need to be able to have on WhatsApp. You don't have a white, what do you use? What is that cream color that you're going to use instead of white on your website?

You know what I mean? Like you need that. And then so, um, so you need like to, you need your neutral tones to, to, um, to, to counterbalance your, your, um, your main, uh, Like primary, like, um, colors that you, you use to exude your personality. And so I come, you know, so I know like, and I know enough times where I've, I've done this enough where even when they do a rebrand, I'm like, just shuffle your colors and see what you come up with.

She's like, Oh, I'm like, you, you know, Do you notice you didn't have a change of colors at all? And then, and they're like, Oh, you're right. Like this set of colors can look feminine and masculine. It can look fun and it can look professional and corporate and like, and be able to like shuffle all that stuff.

And then, so, um, so anyway, so she is like, so she's the one who I, you know, I, um, we become really good friends in that time. And then, so now she's just, um, She is able to create a very successful business. Um, she loves doing pop ups. So she's like in San Francisco doing markets and doing, you know, and then so like, so her brand is beyond just her labels and her, you know, it was like, she's putting together basically her entire feel like this, her entire aesthetic.

Aesthetic of her entire shop based on the brand that, you know, we've created together. Right. Because there's a guideline now. Like she knows what kind of color tablecloths she should have. She knows what kinds of, you know, plants she should have on her, you know, and all that stuff. It's just easy. And so she was like, people come to me because of my branding.

Like they come to, they come to my booth because it looks so good. Mm-Hmm. , um. But, um, but they stay because my product is great. And then, so, um, so, and that's the, that's what, that's what I want. Right. And then, so, um, and then, and it's a joy, you know, I do think that the people who do really, really well in my course are the ones who are creatives themselves.

Right. Like they're creatives, but they're not designers. Right. They're, they understand that they, they appreciate colors. They appreciate like all of these things. And so that's why product based businesses who are creatives and makers who have a sense of aesthetic, they love it because they were like, I don't know design.

But I know creative, I can appreciate it. So I'm like, I'm giving them basically all of the missing parts of their language, um, to be able to put together. put together this for themselves. It's like you're a translator from this wild, energetic, creative brain, translating it to the business world and maybe the consumer itself.

You're making that connection in a sense, right? Yeah. And then so having that logo. So I have another, you know, like another, you know, product based business, but you know, that's, um, you know, her, when she, I still remember the moment I saw her logo come together. She did it the whole thing herself. I didn't touch it.

I was like, that is insane. And I'm like, she did it herself. And then from the moment she was able to put together her colors, I kid you not, that was a seven day by day seven, her whole website. was done. She was that driven. She redid it. And so now I go and I look at her Instagram, her, her photos are different.

Everything is different. This is from two years ago. And then, so now I look at it, I'm like, she's completely transformed her business. And then she, you know, and then that's the thing that she was like, you've taught me to look things very differently. She was like, I never understood how to create mood boards.

I've never, never understood how to like, um, you know, create an aesthetic, you know? And then, so. And that's the thing is like, even those who like, um, I have someone right now who's going through it with me. And she was like, Calvina, if you can do this with me, you can do it with anyone because she was like, I can't do anything visual.

And then so, but the, what she created now, it's really awesome. And I'm like, you're not giving yourself enough credit because most people don't. And then, um, was she just like a word person? Like I can talk about feelings and no, I think she just has no sense. Like she felt like she had no sense of aesthetic.

Like she was like, I come and like, yeah, Like from her current stuff, it's all over the place. But now like, you know, we were able to, I'm like, just distill it down. I'm like, just keep it really simple. Right? Like let's just keep it minimal. So I gave her actually a word. I'm like the, like the, your aesthetic that you've, we've come up together.

It's minimalist, you know, like it's minimalist, contemporary, modern. So now you know what you want to look like. That's gotta be easy then for her to translate. For her to be able to, yes. That doesn't fit. Okay. Exactly. So I'm like, so that means you only use one font and we're going to choose that font. And it's called minimalist modern aesthetic.

So you want one word, one photo on white, that's it. Right. And then, so, so I'm able to kind of help her to do that. I'm like, and then, so like, she'll bring in stuff. And then she was like, um, I'm like, Oh, that's, you know, like, you're putting way too many colors. Yes. I helped you to develop these colors, but I'm like, use these colors only to flag certain ideas, but not as your main aesthetic and don't use them all at the same time, you know?

And so different aesthetics are different things. And so, and then I of course like would have like, um, somebody who is like, um, you know, she does costume designs and she sells it to, you know, to, to like theater and she sells it to even Hollywood. And like, so her aesthetic is like taking repurposed clothing and, um, turning it into, um, Into something else that you're not clothing just repurposed anything and she turns it into art work Upcycling and then so so her whole aesthetic is crazy busy funky And then so and so her tendency was to throw everything in there and I'm like, okay Well, there needs to be an order to your funky and then so I'm trying to help her define what her order looks like the world Can't handle in a funky.

Yeah And then, so I'm like, so then you put her side by side with the other person who was about sustainability, um, who is the modern minimalist. I'm like, do you see how different you are? You guys are actually doing very simpler things. You're repurposing things. You're all about sustainability, but your aesthetic is completely different.

And then that's what defines you as a brand. And that's why I'm passionate about it. When people see how different they are, they're not threatened by anyone else doing something the same as that, because there's no such thing as anyone doing the same thing is that even if you are, you know, you and I are designers, but we're so different, you know, like our approach is different, our passion is different, like how we everything is different.

And that's what makes us great. And that's why that's why it'll be great for us to collaborate and help each other rather than like, you know, feeling like everyone's competing against us, right? And so, um, too big of a world. Yeah, exactly. And then so like, so I am like, you know, um, you know, I, you know, when people say they come into the program, they do the same things.

There's never ever once where, um, you know, people felt like, um, you know, I'm threatened by another person because they realize now the sense of their individuality, have their uniqueness, how it's special and makes them. So it is a transformative thing on the inside. And that's what I'm like, That the visual is just at the top, everything else at the bottom.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, there's a lot of similarities, but there's also so many differences. And it's funny, we, as a culture are so tuned in now to brand because we're, washes over our brain. So we actually, our antenna is tuned into all of those little intricacies around brand differentiations that maybe 30, 40, 50 years ago, That didn't exist at all.

Yes. People didn't consider it or to have any value. Or it wasn't important. Yeah. And I think because, um, I think the method of, uh, branding, it's, it's, it's changed like the method of delivery, the method of how people are consuming information has changed. And I think a largely is because of social media and, um, you know, we're so overloaded of information.

So whereas like, you know, we're no longer in the days of mad men, right? Like when you have time to work on that kind of campaign, things are quicker and faster. And then so, um, in my best way, I'm just trying to fit, fill that gap, right. And for that change, when you're working with people, there's a feedback loop that needs to take place during this.

How difficult is that? Is there, do you feel like sometimes they need more and more or less? Where, how does that work? What's the process? I guess. Yeah. The feedback is the most important part of this whole thing is what I realized. Cause I've taken, you know, quite a few groups through this and, um, I've even tried this program, um, in a different format and a different way where they get less of my feedback.

And, um, because, you know, honestly, you can take this course on your own. It's there's a, you can self guided, you can do the whole thing. It's like all the information is there, right? It's, it's in there, it's pre recorded. It's in the form of like an online course, like any online course. But the most powerful part of this is this, like in, um, when we're sitting in a group.

during that bootcamp. So honestly, like the, the, the brand in a week is the bootcamp week, right? That's the key thing. And, but you can, um, a lot of these people they've had, like, you know, depending on when they purchased the course, they would have had that already, but the bootcamp itself. And then, so, um, so they've, so they have work to do.

They've got, you know, um, you know, It's they're learning by doing but then what's really reflective is This work that I see right what I see and then they talk about it So it's um, I have to do this in a really small setting so like no more than 20 people, you know And then so they're watching everyone else do it and then so and I've done it with a tiny group To like, or even a group of one or two to like a group of like, you know, 20.

Right. And so, um, so it really depends on, um, and they've all gotten different things. Like the smaller groups are like, I had so much of your time. That was awesome. But the ones who had in the bigger group, they're like, I loved seeing other people's transformation. Cause it gave me so many ideas of my own.

Um, and like, we can like bounce, the energy was different and it was still great. Just as good, but just in a different way. And so, um, so that personalized feedback is the most important thing when I can see, and just like the teacher, like, you know, like who can see a student's work, you don't get it. I mean, I can tell when they don't get it and then, but I can like find that pain point and push them and I can say, okay, You're not getting this part.

Like, but I've, you know, but I like the first day is all about getting things out of their heads. It's helping them to define that it's a discovery process. I guide them through discovery process. So that means I start seeing them and I teach them how to start seeing their own vision. Like, and like basically move, like bring it out.

So even people who are expert marketers can go through my, um, my program. I have, I actually have like VP of marketing, you know, like going through it, but then they've never gone through it in their own head. They've never like saw things through. their own lens. And then, so that means it's like a, it's a therapy, right?

Like being able to see and reflect back to like what they're actually, what they feel in here to actually see it. But then when I, when I see what they come up with, I'm like, you know what, based on what I know your vision is, I think that you need to get more narrow and to hear, you know, move in this direction a little more, create more, you know, more definition for this, because I think that you're not there yet.

Okay. I'm very honest with them. Like, you need to push harder, like do more. And you're, you're thinking your philosophy there is just to kind of keep digging in, going deeper into that niche. So very narrow, very deep. Yes. Deep, deep, deep. And then, so they need to feel it and, and see it. So, um, sometimes, you know, depending on their commitment, depending on like their level of, like, I guess, Your expertise or like they're like how savvy they are, you know, like I have, you know, people get different levels of success, but, um, you know, and, but then if at the end of the week, even if say they have not like, and there have been people where it's like, Ooh, at the end of the week, it's still not quite there.

If I can get them to truly like visualize, like, like put into visuals what they're feeling and their vision, then I consider that a success. And so that the, actually the program in itself, it's three months long. So it's called Brandon week because the bootcamp is a week so they can complete it. So most of them by the end of the week it's done.

And so, um, you know, they've gotten like all the pieces, but they need to practice it. Yeah. So they need to implement it. So I'm like, so, um, so you know that the week is done, but then I'm like, okay, well. So we need to actually put it into practice. So then, yeah, talk a little bit about that. Cause that would be my next question is, you know, great.

You've handed this thing over and if you're lucky, you get to do the implementation and build things out for them, but here's this baby now of, you can hand this over to another team or what do they typically do and how to. What do you give them tips or advice? It sounds like you've got more into the program.

So actually my, like my ideal scenario, like I can, I would consider myself success if they can do it on their own. I mean, of course, for my monetary gain, of course, come hire me. Um, and that's, there's, there are times when, I mean, I don't know, like in terms of success, like, you know, I don't, I want them, like, I want them to be able to own it, I want them to know it.

So, so we will start actually doing projects. So during that is no longer every single day. We'll meet every other week. And then, so they'll bring in projects that they've done, like whether it's like a, like, Hey, I've been wanting to redesign my whole course, my whole workbook, my lead magnet, my, you know, like, or, you know, I've had product based meetings.

Business that spend like the next month or up to three months re redesigning their whole product, all the product labels and tags. And like, I need to maybe pull together an event. So whatever, everyone looks different, right? Like, and so I need to pull together event. I need to design all the signage and all the, all that stuff.

And then, so the bring in all the work and then so. That means, you know, I can give them that personalized critique and say, you know what, that design is, um, and that's when I start like really teaching them visual hierarchy. This is way too many words. You need to edit like crazy. Let's take this out. This is not effective.

This is busy. And like that's when I'm like kind of go into a little bit more of a design class type of a thing, but it's their designs. So it's like a DIY model really. You're just the coach, the guide, the coach. And then like, I like, you know, and then, so again, depending on how Committed they are to their own craft and their own work they can really take advantage of that and they can like launch websites in that time they can like, you know, um, you know, they can be like, completely redesigning the entire like their entire like save their coach themselves and they like, You know, like work on all their course slides, all their, you know, their workbooks.

They can work on all that stuff. So, so every, you know, they can, they can really take advantage and be targeted during that three months. They're familiar with the platforms. They've done it already. They just need to go in and replace logos and colors. Exactly. And then, so there's just need to replace their, all of these things.

And, and, um, and so, so that's what the three month is for. It's just to, to really get that work. And then, so, um, and it's at the end of those three months there, they're like, okay, um, Can you just do some more for me? And then so I'll just take what they have and I will really quickly. Now I see what they're after.

Right. It's, I'm in their heads. I can see it. Interesting. And then so I'll take their existing work and I can actually create things for them. And then now they can really run with, now, now it's a real complete brand. So let's talk about the beginning of the story. I'd love to learn like how did you come up with this concept of, you know, there's the, We'll do it all for you.

There's the do it with you. You're going to do it and I'll guide you. That wasn't as a common, I don't think years ago, but still, I don't think it's common. Yeah. Yeah. It's where, where did it generate? Was it just a request from one client? Was it something that you purposely like, Hey, this is what I see in the marketplace was a combination of something that I wish I need.

I had, uh, as a small business, I had to design my own website, right? Okay. I had to come up with my own branding as, as Calvina photography. I didn't know, like I was way too close to my own brand. I hired my, um, my friend who was the designer to do my logo because I'm like, I can't do this myself. I'm way too close to it.

But it just all this painful back and forth even then. And then in the end, like, you know, and it's like, it's like, so. you know, in the end I, you know, she just did the logo for me. That's it. Right. Like I still had to come up with my colors. I still had to figure out which is the best fonts to use. You know, I had to do like, you know what, it's, I had developed my, and designed my own website, do all of that stuff.

And I'm like, I wish somebody could just tell me, cause I'm way too close to this. And then, um, even as a designer, you know, and so, um, so these are things that I wish that had, and because I run my own business, as one, right? Like as that one person, I'm like, you got to do your own social media post. You got to do all of these things.

You got to do everything yourself. And it's like, and like, um, because, and that's why, you know, these small teams, tiny little businesses that are starting, um, and that it's, it's, it's very difficult to, um, prioritize their visuals because they're working on their revenue. They're working on their product.

They're working on that. their stuff looks like crap. So always, I feel like when people come to me is that they've the perfect time to come to me. It's like people have been in business actually for about three years or so that they've actually been doing it themselves for all of this time. And they realized, well, for me to get to the next level, I got to stop looking like crap.

But I, I recognize the importance of remaining in this, Doing this because, um, especially where marketing is now, you know, like, um, like I want to be able to give direction to my team. And so I need to know more. And it's interesting because you're building, basically, you're helping them build a system. And I think that that's really the, probably the only way that these initiatives have success is if it's not just, here's a bunch of stuff, good luck.

It's really more of a system and a way of thinking and maybe helping them to organize their day, month, week around some of these goals. time block things out so that, okay, I'm going to work on the website, but with this realization, with this clarity and this set of tools. Yes. And boom, boom, boom. Exactly.

And then actually I'm talking to more agency friends who have been needing more of this. So like I like, so, you know, I'm in some conversations where I'm working side by side, like for me, like I am a small business. And so I'm working with these small businesses, but I see the importance of all of this in marketing teams and be able to provide this kind of level of service and education for, for teams.

And then I also have agency friends who are like, I see the gap and where you can fill in. in that education process, whether it's in the very beginning or at the very end. Um, and then still have the, you know, the, still the design team being involved in doing all the things in the middle. But that's just that like, no, like, um, you know, um, the, the level of depth that I can get in the beginning is important.

And also the level of education in the end where I'm like, let me help you transfer this so that you, your, your team can feel more equipped, um, with knowing what to do. That's important too. Do you do a lot of teaching of tools specifically as far as here's my, if, oh, you're this kind of an organization, you're going to want to use Canva and HubSpot and do you have this prescribed solution?

Well right now my primary thing is in is Canva because of the fact that like, um, and I was in the middle of, I know I was, I was telling you, it was like, it took me years to get over my own ego, design ego. Is that like, um, truly, you know, there's so many, Still, I mean, I think Canva is up and coming. It's, it's, it's huge.

But then there are things that Canva can't, can do that. Um, I mean, I would still, there are things that I would transfer from Adobe to Canva because it's so much faster for me to do in Canva. Right. And, and Adobe hasn't, um, truthfully hasn't really perfected the speed and the efficiency yet because they're so good at.

creating, you know, like, um, you know, the, the power and they're, they're so good at that. I mean like no, no, nothing on either end. They're both great products, but I just truly use them for different things. And so, um, so I do teach that. And then, so I am kind of a tech person. But I haven't really taught tech necessarily other than Canva just because I'm like, Oh, there's one more thing to teach.

But I have a huge tech stack that I personally use, right? And then so, um, I, you know, like in like some of the, if I have an opportunity to work with clients, then I, you know, I do do that, but it's not in my, like, my normal teaching. It's just one more thing for me to, to teach. I mostly teach Canva, but I teach Canva in different ways.

I'll teach Canva on, like, how to use Canva for, like, say, um, how can you use Canva, like, for your link and bio, you know? Like, that's a really great way. You don't have to pay in link and bio. You can just use Canva to make a link and bio because you can almost publish it out as a website. Like as a website that you can link to.

And then how do you use like, um, client portals? I'm like, you can, I'm not in a place where I, I feel good about using Canva quite honestly for websites. But I'm like, but for a client portal, yeah. Like when you can just publish a link and then you can have like all your, Portal information. It's free. And it's like, and you know, almost like a website and you have all your client information, you know, you can create this beautiful user experience for them in camera, like, so stuff like that I'll teach, like on the, on the technical level, let's break down what you mean by portal, what, just explain what that looks like.

Cause that could mean a few different things, but I want to know, like for me, I use Canva for my client portals. So like, what is it? What is a client portal? Like, so, and all the information that I need for them to know, like, so like I'll like, so when I, when I deliver something to a client, I'm like, here are the steps in your, like, here, here's the roadmap, right.

Of what, um, our, our process is going to look like. So I'll define that on there. And then every, like I'll update that and then like links, I'll have create links for them. Like, so, so here's my presentation here. Here's the. them something that they can easily access. And with a single link, they have all the, everything's, everything's directory, everything files, files, deliverables right there too.

So I can link that. And so it's a website that's done. I don't need to have this like complicated thing of like having to embed this into my current website and have a login and all that stuff. I'm like, Oh, I just, I don't want to deal with that. I just want to like deliver something that my clients can like, bookmark, you know, during our project and they can go there and all their deliverables, all their presentations are in one place.

Do they get to keep that forever though? Yeah. I mean, yeah, because it's on, yeah, my account, like, I mean, it depends on if I might feel like shutting it down, but it's, um, but like usually for the length of the project. That I think is something that is really a critical tool. So for any, especially single.

You know, solo marketer is like limit the amount of clicks and places. I got to go to find everything. I know everybody's still struggling with that. Yeah. So I like to, you know, I'll, I'll teach stuff like that. Like, but usually it's, it's, it is in the camera base, but then, um, just because I've come to love that for running multiple aspects of my business, um, more than just design, right.

It's just, it's really functional. And then I edit videos on there because I can like, you know, it's, it's not the best editing, like fancy, but then like in terms of like me being able to like, just, um, collaborate with somebody and say, Hey, can you help me finish editing this? And then like, I just kind of threw this stuff in and then like, it's just easy.

It's not the most sophisticated yet, but it's mostly social videos, kind of things like shorts and nothing like nothing that the complicated, nice like shorts. So shorts, like where it's like, you're like, not, it's nothing complicated. Like, you know, my, yeah. Like one minute video, a short story. But that's the look that's supposed to be genuine and a real person.

And I'm connecting with them. But it looks a little, here's a PDF or here's a screenshot. And even my, my, even my courses are not complicated. And I do the editing in Canva too, because it's just, I'm going through the slides, slide in, slide that, and you know, like all that stuff. So I'm going to have my face and it doesn't need to be this.

I'm not shooting everything on like, you know, like really nice cameras. I'm like basically showing like. Infographics, you know, and stuff like that. I can edit that easily in Canva. So very, very light and nimble in one place. And then because, and then like, so unlike say, um, I mean, I've, I've done premiere, I've done like, I've done those too, but you know, it's hard to integrate like, like assets and things like that.

And that's the nice thing about like, sometimes I'll just throw all my assets into Canva because it's easier for me to import and just put like my design elements and photos. Interesting. Yeah. We don't use Canva I use it for storage. Because you have a terabyte of storage in Canva. Wow. Okay. So I like, so those are the things that I'm like, you're not using Canva enough if you're not using these things.

I'll use it for storage because instead of using Dropbox, I can use Canva. I can store all my photos in there and use more easily. I can just drop things in, drop it in. And so when you're just making a social graphic, that's all you need. You don't need anything fancy. So, um, so yeah, like, I mean, just like things.

So I, I, I, I think. I'm, oh, wow. Okay. No, I'm, I'm, I'm a Intrigued now, I'll spend the rest of the afternoon playing around in Canva. I don't think I'll ever get rid of Adobe, but I can see what you're talking about. I mean, if you have all that stuff, you've, you've almost kind of created not just a portal with resources library, but then a workspace as well, where you can go build things.

Exactly. And now they have docs. And then there's also, you can, um, basically you've got like something that functions as chat GPT inside their docs, where you can have them write stuff for you. It's really quite powerful like the extent of what you can use it for. And then so, so that's why I would never get over rid of Adobe.

I used Adobe just as much. I mean, not just as much as I think I, because there's so many different assets in my business that's not in design. So I probably use Canva more, but then when I am truly need great designs, I mean like I can't, like I have to do it with Adobe, like I have to. And so, I mean, they're different things.

I can't print still in camera. Like I, you know, like I can't print well. So like, if I'm like working in print and I need to make tags and things like that, Canva is still a big pain. Yeah. We did a podcast about that talking about, you know, yeah, we we've had requests where I built my trade show booth in Canva and we're like, Oh, that's awesome.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry. Yeah. We'll take that from here. Yeah, yeah. And do it ourselves. So. Is there anything that keeps you up at night? What, what worries you? What do you see? What, now that you, you deal with a lot of these people, um, who are passionate now about their brand. Yeah. Is there anything that, I mean, we've got, You know, AI is always a benefit and a little bit of a threat.

You know, there's a mixed message around AI. Is there just overall, I mean, I think people overall are understanding more and more the power of a brand and how that can be leveraged and used. business and outside of business, even. I mean, I love, I think that like my favorite thing to do probably is brand in a week and the program that I was built that I built, I love working with clients and like getting that light bulb moment.

And I think that that's truly what I'm after is that, you know, them feeling. Finally comfortable in their own skin, you know, I think that's everything to me. And then so, um, but you know, when it comes to say the, what keeps me at night, it's just, it's, it's my own business and it's what running how hard it is to run my own business.

That's the hard part, right? It's that like the content creation, the, you know, the, the having to market and create and work with clients and all of that stuff. name at the same time. And, you know, I, you know, like my boss is a slave driver. She's hard on me, you know, like she's right here. I know. I mean, so, and I realized that sometimes I realize that I'm like, yeah, I have to kind of separate the bodies and realize, you know, It's not being so hard on yourself and because I realized there are, you know, I might have unrealistic expectations and, um, and that progress takes time and, um, but like having to do it all, that's the stuff that keeps me up at night, having to do it all.

Do my own marketing, having to work with my clients, having to do the content creation, having to do all of that as, you know, um, I mean, I, I have, um, you know, amazing VA that I work with. I contract out when I can, but at the same time, at the end of the day, it's all on me. And the, the vision sometimes gets.

It's hard because, um, what I realized, and I know you totally understand this is that like you have ideas and you just want to run with all of your ideas at the same time. And then so, and you, and then like when they don't, you know, and you, you take time, like, you know, like building your email list, building your, your, um, your community, building all that stuff.

takes time. It's not going to happen overnight. Lightning can strike, but you have to be ready when, you know, um, I've struck lightning actually, I've had a viral video, but then I was not in a place in my business to take advantage of that or I knew how. And then, so, you know, that opportunity comes and goes.

And then so, so at the end of the day, um, as a marketer for my own business, I realized that I have to, um, one, I have to Be kinder to myself. I have to give myself patience. I have to realize these really good things build over time and that trending things won't last, but you can lean into it, take advantage of the trending things.

But however, at the end of the day is like understanding what your strategy is ending, being hyper, hyper focused and, and staying true and consistent. To it, even though there are a million shiny objects that will get in the way and like distract you from it because they do I think that is everywhere, right?

I mean we have so many so much choice now And that's what that's what drives you crazy And that's the stuff that keeps it. It's not the it's not my work I love my work and I do think that like that's what I was put on earth to do like is to to Really listen? is to really help people to see and if I can get them just to see a glimpse of who they are.

And what they're made to be, I feel like I can help them to do anything because they have me if they, even if they feel like they can't do it for themselves, they have me and then they have some, you know, like, so I feel like that's what happens at the end of that program, right? Like, even if they say, even after that program, they're like, you know what, I don't know if I was made to do this.

I don't know if I can do this design on my own, but hey, like I've got everything out of their heads and I can help them do it. Bring it to completion. It just builds that partnership. It speaks a little bit too. We speak a little bit about the quality of Long term relationships that we've got with some of our clients.

There's a shorthand that develops. Yes over time and there's a trust Yeah, there's a shared history and you can refer back to that and that by saying two words You have the 10, 000 word story on your head, you know, and you're gonna lean into that Yeah. And then it's, and it's, and it's, again, putting aside my own ego.

It's not just about me either. It's about them being able to communicate to anyone they hire down the line. And that's powerful is that I want them to be able to hire another designer. You know, I want them to be able to hire an illustrator and a photographer and be able to know that they'll like nail it because they can communicate what they're wanting.

Yeah. Is it B2B? Is it B2C? Who, who makes up the people that go through your brand spark process? That's the thing is that they come to me, right? Like they, like I, I thought it was, I thought it was the product based business, but when I put it like that, like when I'm like having them to design, they were like, I all need this.

Like, so, so that's why I, you know, I'm in a program with so many different kinds of people and, um, but I do feel like the people who really thrive and they love it. I do think that the product based businesses love it just because there's so much more application they can do with it, you know, um, so I see a lot more of what they can do because they can make tags, they can make labels, they can make signage, they can make all of these things and their social media and their websites, all of those things.

Whereas like, you know, um, you know, there's less necessarily like application with some, you know, some others, but then that is still nonetheless just Just as important. Sure. Even if it's in an email. Yes. Email headers. The email needs to not only look good, but it also needs to sound right too. Your presentation, everyone I feel like needs a presentation somehow, right?

Like when you're doing a pitch, when you're doing some kind of, you know, like something. And so like, I like to really like get people to, to, to do that. So I have people coming in here and they're like, I want to do a website. I'm like, don't do that right now. Like don't do that. Put together a presentation because when you're putting into the presentation, you get a better sense of like how your, your words will flow with a certain background with imagery.

And then, you know, after this program, then you can translate this into something more. In a sense. Yeah. You know, the going through building a presentation is in a sense like building a website. I mean, you could really take that. Without all the technical, like stuff that you need to think about, which platform do I'm in?

Like, don't, you know, like I don't want you to spend your time to even thinking about that. You can't even hand that off to a designer and say, These two pages are gonna be this page. Yep. This page is gonna be the homepage. Exactly. Exactly. That's kind of a cool way to think about that. Yeah. Yeah. Because that's something that everybody can do.

They can design, everything can do. And that's why, um, I'm really surprised that there is not a specific niche and like, I, I, and, and you know, and that, and I think that's rare. 'cause I tell everyone to pick a niche, you know what I mean? Like, there isn't a specific like dream client for me it's like, it's, it's, it's more of about a matter of timeline where they are.

Yeah. They have been doing this and like basically building a business for three to five years. Yeah. And they have like really taken traction. They've started selling, they have some money and then, but they realize that they don't look buttoned up. They don't look where they need to be in order for them to grow some more.

Go to that next level. Yeah, they need to go to the next level. And then so, and then that's pretty much it. There's different ways of looking at this, right. Different philosophies of hiring and, um, you know, I, like, and even in my own stuff, like having, like to do so many different, where so many different hats in my own business, I wouldn't know how to hand off to somebody if I hadn't figured that out, my, for myself.

And then, so, so that's why I still feel like no matter what, you need to figure this out first. I'm not like, so that's the thing is that like I, you know, I've talked to designers who have kind of like given me the like, you know, the side eye, like, Are you serious? Are you really doing this kind of thing?

And then so I have to get over that, right? Like there was a time when I personally had a really, like, internal struggle because I felt a little bit down. embarrassed hanging around with like a designer circle where I'm like, I'm going to get judged by all these designers. Cause I'm like, basically, um, you know, maybe training a bunch of support designs.

Right. And then, so, but for me, I realized is way beyond that. It's not even about that. Like I actually want to these designers to know that like, no, you actually need to understand this part of this process right now in this time in our industry. And then it doesn't take away from your jobs. Well, that's the thing about designers is that the, you know, they, think they've got it all in their heads.

And if they, the, sometimes the better the designer, the more of that feeling they have, you know, and it's just kind of, yeah, that perfection, I can do it all. I know I've got control, but the reality is, is that. You know, all of these tools are democratizing. They're bringing in all kinds of people to it. So we can't just fight that as designers.

I did discount everything because it's not the way we do it. You know, there is value to allowing, you know, we build templates for a lot of our clients and just hand them off and like, good luck. Yeah. And they love that. That empowers them. They don't. Have to call us every week or two days or something like that.

So that's the whole thing with being, you know, being, being inclusive and also, you know, not having a scarcity mindset when it comes to this stuff. Is that like, I feel like, um, this like, and I, this is why I, I, my passion is in education, right? Like, um, and not to say that like it replaces the craft. It's just that like, you know, people need to have a better sense of who they are.

And I feel like it's such a psychological process. It's like therapy, you know, like people come out like having a better sense of who they are, even if they are like, okay, I'm going to admit, I cannot do this design. I need you to do it for me. But now I feel so much more connected to what I'm doing. What I actually can't create.

Do you, do you have an incorporated crying couch into your process at all? Do you think that that's important? Maybe you need to have a virtual crying couch? What's crazy is that like, um, I think half of my, like during the brand in a week, I am like soothing people because they're frustrated and I have to constantly remind that I'm like, you know what, like this is so important.

I have to constantly remind the pain you're feeling. going through right now is going to lead to your breakthrough. You have to feel this, and this is going to be what's hard for me to like, and that's the thing is that like, I'm still in the process of combining my deliver it for you and the, this into something in the middle.

Right. So I'm still trying to like figure out the best, most efficient way for me to do that on a one, one on one basis. basis outside of this group because they, you know, they get more out of me if I can work with them one on one because now also that incorporates some business coaching and there's some like marketing coaching that goes into that, like that has like that can tailor more into that.

But the thing is, I don't want them to feel like, Oh, Calvin is in my corner now she can do all my design. I'm like, no, because you actually like, I need to get them to that pain where they're almost crying. Like, you know, and they're like, I don't get it. I don't get it like this. I can't do this. I'm like, no, you can.

I see it. Like, and I, Like, I don't, like, how many times do I, like, I'm always like, I actually see it. You don't see it. I see it, but it's not enough for me to see it. You've got to see this. So I make some, I push them through, I push them through and I'm like, but you know, I know you're feeling the pain.

You're on the verge of tears, but I promise when you get to the other side, it's going to be that much more clear to you. And then that's the pain. This is, that's the crux of it all. That's the pain that actually is the breaking, breakthrough point for them. And that's the breakthrough point that I will never have doing a surgery.

You know, when I deliver. Something for them. Yeah, it's in fact, it's the opposite. You don't really want to deliver pain. Yes, when you're delivering right project And that's what's actually hard for my own marketing. Do you see like Because how who would buy off on your marketing pain because they want me to do it for them because that's the whole point But then you know, the point of clarity is so important for the rest of their business for the long term Well, that's it.

He's like when you go through trauma You tend to remember that stuff and that's what you're kind of Yeah. Bringing the bear a little bit as we're going to go through some tough times. We're going to have some hard conversations. You're going to cry. again for being here. Could you share with us again how people might want to get in touch with you?

Yeah. So, um, I am at yourbrandspark. com and I'm on your brand spark in all the places. Instagram, TikTok and, um, you know, Pinterest. I'm still in Calvina, but I mean, when I'm just like all the platforms, um, and if you actually are interested in brand in a week, you can just go to brand in a week. com and get to the brand in a week course.

And then, um, there's a waiting list. I'm opening up my next cohort in October, the 1st of October. And then, um, you know, we run that through basically, um, You know, for three months, but this is going to be until February actually, because there's holidays and I like to take time off during the holidays. So, yeah, I, I'm actually very active on social media.

I'm active on Instagram, on Tik TOK. Well, it's a lot of work. Yes. The social channels can be a little bit of a time suck for sure. But, uh, yeah, you do a good job of that stuff on there. So thank you again. Thank you. That was so fun. Thank you for having me. I loved it. I loved, I loved being here. I mean look at this.

I mean you got fake plants everywhere. Look at this. You can't go wrong. You're allowed to cry, you know, doesn't even encourage it here. I'm crying.

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